Tag set to date, and a question

[sholio]

Since the tag list on AO3 is hard to read, a complete list of all tags currently in the set is under the cut. Everything submitted so far has been processed.

Question: What are your thoughts on including Arnim Zola as an allowable character tag? He only appears briefly in AC, but he does appear. I'm on the fence about this, because last year I don't think I allowed Steve to be nominated as a standalone character even though he also appears (in flashbacks), though either character as part of a pairing with an AC character is fine. DISCUSS.


Ana Jarvis
Angie Martinelli
Joseph Manfredi
Michael Carter
Arnim Zola
Daniel Sousa
Dottie Underwood
Edwin Jarvis
Howard Stark
Jack Thompson
Jason Wilkes
Johann Fennhoff
Peggy Carter
Roger Dooley
Rose Roberts
Violet (Agent Carter)
Whitney Frost

Relationship: Daniel Sousa & Jack Thompson
Relationship: Daniel Sousa/Jack Thompson
Relationship: Daniel Sousa/Joseph Manfredi/Howard Stark
Relationship: Daniel Sousa/Violet
Relationship: Dottie Underwood & Whitney Frost
Relationship: Dottie Underwood/Whitney Frost
Relationship: Edwin Jarvis & Howard Stark
Relationship: Howard Stark/Joseph Manfredi
Relationship: Howard Stark/Rose Roberts
Relationship: Original Character/Jack Thompson
Relationship: Peggy Carter & Ana Jarvis
Relationship: Peggy Carter & Angie Martinelli
Relationship: Peggy Carter & Daniel Sousa
Relationship: Peggy Carter & Daniel Sousa & Jack Thompson
Relationship: Peggy Carter & Dottie Underwood
Relationship: Peggy Carter & Edwin Jarvis
Relationship: Peggy Carter & Howard Stark
Relationship: Peggy Carter & Jack Thompson
Relationship: Peggy Carter & Rose Roberts
Relationship: Peggy Carter & Violet
Relationship: Peggy Carter/Angie Martinelli
Relationship: Peggy Carter/Daniel Sousa
Relationship: Peggy Carter/Daniel Sousa/Jack Thompson
Relationship: Peggy Carter/Dottie Underwood
Relationship: Peggy Carter/Jack Thompson
Relationship: Peggy Carter/James "Bucky" Barnes
Relationship: Peggy Carter/Jason Wilkes
Relationship: Peggy Carter/Steve Rogers/Howard Stark
Relationship: Rose Roberts & Jack Thompson
Relationship: Peggy Carter & the Howling Commandos

Comments

[saturnofthemoon]

I'm not signing up this year, but I would say he counts.

[sholio]

Thanks! I'm leaning that way myself.

[muccamukk]

I'd count him more than Steve, as Steve was just film footage, where as Zola had a new scene.

But I wrote 2/3 fic with more of a Cap 1 setting than an AC setting :D

[sholio]

I'm leaning strongly towards including him. ... Well, to be fair, at this point he's included unless I take him out, since I approved the nomination before I got to thinking about it. But I think it's reasonable to include any character who has a speaking part in the AC show -- I mainly just wanted to avoid ending up with fic that had nothing to do with AC at all. And that didn't turn out to be a problem in the slightest last year, so I doubt it'll suddenly become a problem now.

[nonnie009]

I think he should be included as well. *However*, I understand if you'd rather avoid him, and Steve as well, to be nominated as solo characters, if you fear that the Captain America's canon would take over the exchange, since this wouldn't it be the place for Cap's movies fic.

Would it work to make a rule(?) where fanworks exclusively about Zola or Cap alone must be with show setting, or show-related AUs? For example, Steve never goes down with the plain and works at the SSR/is the SSR big boss; or we get to see that Zola is the main enemy who bosses Masters (the guy who takes over the SSR at some point during the Second Season)? Storylines like these would be fine, anything where Steve does Avenging stuff with his team or alone, or where Zola sets up the Hydra with no, or only passing, Agent Carter stuff mentions, would be considered OT.

On the other hand, I suppose it would be too hard to mod something like this, where to draw a line on what is it fine or isn't fine? What if someone writes a too-Cap-related story for a blank signup, should the story be rejected and the request go to the pinch hits?

[sholio]

Mmmm, yeah, while I appreciate the suggestion (and everyone's input!), the problem with a rule like that is that it would be too arbitrary to mod. I don't want to get into the role of policing individual stories for canonicity.

We didn't have any problems at all last year with people writing stories that weren't AC-related, so I think I'm going to go ahead and approve the nomination and then handle things on a case-by-case basis if it turns out that there are any issues. Otherwise it feels a little bit like it's a solution in search of a problem.

[nonnie009]

Sounds reasonable. :) I also don't think (and I hope it's not the case) that anyone would signing up to an Agent Carter gift exchange just in order to write/request Cap stuff.

On another note, eeeeh I'm excited! :D

[selenak]

Having nominated Zola: here's why. The tag scene of s1 indicates a future scheming relationship with Ivchenko/Fenhoff/Faustus, who certainly does appear as an important recurring character in s1. I want to ask for Ivchenko character exploration, the development from lives saving Doctor (see flashback) to Leviathan belonging avenger (no pun intended) to America-is-the-land-of-opportunity nascent SHIELD subverter (which the Zola encounter clearly is setting up), and Zola is a necessary character for this.

My other Zola related idea is that I want a future fic scene detailing when and how Peggy hires him, but I'm not sure whether or not to ask for this because it's part of the "five times Peggy Carter morally compromised" thing which one of these days I do want to write myself. Otoh the Ivchenko/Fenhoff/Faustus story is one I do want to request, whether or not someone takes me up on it.

[sholio]

Sorry, I wasn't meaning to call anyone out with that question! Thanks for the explanation; this makes sense to me, and as noted in comments above, I'm planning to keep him in the tagset this year, so by all means, go ahead and make the request. It sounds like a fascinating idea to explore, and there's next to no fic in the fandom with Ivchenko/Fennhoff at all.

... btw, were you also the one who nominated Fennhoff? That's another one I approved as-is, but now that I'm typing this, I'm wondering if he should be in the tagset as Fennhoff or as Ivchenko. I guess it might not really matter since it's the same character.

[selenak]

Yes, that was me. The tag set wouldn't give me Ivchenko at all, and the only character tag set already existing only said "Johann Fenhoff", hence nominating him as this, though the impression you get in Agent Carter is that his Russian identity is the original one.

I'm glad! I thought he was really interesting in s1, and as you say, unexplored so far.

[(Anonymous)]

Sorry for poking in but, OMG he's the 'focus' guy isn't he? I couldn't recall his name, all I knew was that the 'focus' thing became my cousin's running joke for the last couple of years. XD I loved that character. :D

[selenak]

Yes, that was him!

[kore]

I was going to say something like that, but much less coherently. Also, altho this gets into speculation, I think in the never-was third season they might have included Michael Carter in the WS program and had Zola be part of that. I wasn't crazy about that particular idea, if indeed that was where they were going, but it seems to indicate Zola might've been a bigger part of the plot. Including him also brings in how SHIELD was compromised nearly from the very start, which is tragic but interesting.

My other Zola related idea is that I want a future fic scene detailing when and how Peggy hires him, but I'm not sure whether or not to ask for this because it's part of the "five times Peggy Carter morally compromised" thing which one of these days I do want to write myself.

I remember you talking about that, it still sounds fascinating!

[(Anonymous)]

You know, this might not be the place to do that, and I wish I had any idea how to do that myself, but it would be nice to set up rewatch dates thing for the whole show. Something like two episodes rewatch & chat together every weekend, as this gift exchange is still at the early stage and people is going to canon review anyway.

Doing something like this together (for the ones who would want to participate, of course) and chatting and commenting while the scenes are running would be nice.

Sorry, I'll shut up now. X) I know, it's just wishful thinking. Well, mostly.

[muccamukk]

I'd be interested in this too. I 100% need to rewatch before I write anything.

Sholio, I can host if you're busy.

Though looking at the schedule, and given 18 episodes, I think one would have to hit an episode every other day to finish before the writing period was too far gone.

So it might be better to host the comments on DW, and then have an irc chat or something every so often.

[kore]

A rewatch sounds very fun.

[(Anonymous)]

I'm so glad! Thank you for consider to do this. :D I'm totally going to rewatch & chat with all the people who'll take part. Well, provided that the time zone will allow me. Otherwise, I suppose I'll just read offline comments and let fb whenever I am online. :)

[sholio]

I'm delighted you suggested this! :) It looks like there will be a rewatch hosted at muccamukk's journal. I'll post to the community about it once we know more info. :)

[(Anonymous)]

Yay! I'm glad it sounded like a good idea. I look forward to it. :D

[kore]

Oh shoot, Dr Erskine isn't actually in the show, is he? I was thinking of when Peggy rescues him, but that's in the First Vengeance comic. sigh.

There's General Werner Reinhardt in The Things We Bury, too, altho that's an AoS episode. But it's interesting because it shows Peggy interrogating him and saying he would never be free as long as she was alive.

[sholio]

Yeah, he's not in it at all; he's dead by that point in MCU canon.

You can still do Erskine & Peggy as a character relationship, though!

[kore]

OMG RIGHT. //goes back to stare at tag choices some more